Recently, blog reader Dude posted a link to a video in which a follower of PUA doctrine reveals that he was put into a psychiatric ward after a cold approach. Here is the video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZtXApiv-qs
I assume that the information presented is true. Also, I do not want to make fun of this guy, even though you might chuckle a bit when he awkwardly retells his story. Yet, there is a much more serious issue at play here. If you are unattractive or at best moderately attractive, in addition to having mental problems like this young gentleman above, your attempts at interacting with the fair sex are not going to be appreciated very much. The guy above comes across as pretty weird. If this is acting, it could not be any more convincing. Quite frankly, you feel sad for this guy when you listen to this video. He cannot organize his thoughts clearly, and seems to not understand that, for instance, burping on camera is not a good look. He just rambles for a few minutes, does not go into any great depths, and cuts off the video. Such guys really exist, and society does not react well to them.
A fundamental problem of cold approaching women is, of course, that it is pretty bizarre. When women are interested in you, they will make it either clear to you by giving off obvious signals, like smiling at you or flicking their hair, or they do something supposedly ambiguous like hovering around you and avoiding eye contact. In such situations, you can certainly talk to them. This does not mean that you will get laid because plenty of women love getting attention from a man they find attractive, even if they themselves are not sexually available. Of course, there are also cheating whores out there.
In contrast, you cold approach a woman, you start the interaction off on the wrong foot. You are facing an uphill battle because if she has not given you any kind of indication that she is potentially interested in you then the chances are quite high that she really is not. This is why some guys report approaching 1,000 women just to get one date. Of course, men who are that maladapted to society most likely do not even notice when a woman might be into them, so their anti-game leads to them wrecking plenty of perfectly good opportunities.
I furthermore argue that if some PUA cold approaches a woman and it leads to the police being called then they need to learn a lot about basic human behavior. For instance, if a woman has a look of disgust on her face when some weirdo PUA approaches her, the only plausible action that guy could take is to bail, instead of, for instance, following her and “spitting game”. In London I once witnessed a PUA who approached a woman on the street. She quickly looked away and ignored him. He then kept following her, talking louder and louder, and sped up as she increased her pace. Picturing this scene, you can probably understand if such behavior is considered harassment. Clearly, this woman did not “play hard to get” but instead wanted to get away as she felt uncomfortable. I can even understand that some women experience a genuine feeling of panic when some unattractive guy literally chases her down the street.
I do not know the details that led to the PUA above spending some time in a psychiatric ward, following an unsuccessful cold approach, but I would be very surprised if his behavior was not far, far outside the norm of the socially acceptable. There is also a non-zero chance that he was not the first PUA who ended up for observation in a psychiatric ward.
“If you are unattractive or at best moderately attractive, in addition to having mental problems like this young gentleman above, your attempts at interacting with the fair sex are not going to be appreciated very much.”
Oh YES.
This is very true.When an attractive man wishes to have sexual relations or a girlfriend,he is encouraged but when a average/unattractive guy wishes to have a girlfriend and expresses his wishes..not long until he is ridiculed and has to bE tHe BeSt VeRsIoN oF hImSeLf
I think in this guys case its moreso his horrid social skills. She would probably not have been interested either way, but I doubt that this guy would have been institutionalized if he could pick up on signals of disinterest. Guys get rejected all the time and most are not arrested or institutionalized for a clumsy approach (there are exceptions of course).
@Conrad
Also women rarely approach unless ofc he is a Chad.
Aaron has written about his ex girlfriends several times as to how they would try to fix his life/try to get him a job etc etc.
Does Aaron look like a Chad?
Question – did you mean to say that hovering around you and “avoiding” eye contact is a signal that she may be interested?
Yes, indeed. She is afraid to make eye contact. If she looks down when you face her, it can be seen as a sign of submission.
I’ve definitely had that signal before. Unfortunately I did not engage… pain
What would you day if you catch her looking at you? It seems like looking at you = interested, avoiding eye contact = interested, what is not interested?
Either say hi or make a situational remark. It does not really matter what you say.
Conrad, you are ignoring context. If she is hovering around you and looks down when you looking at her, she is likely interested in you.
Aaron, sorry if this is a stupid question, but when you talk about a woman looking down while facing you, do you mean her whole head like a bow? Or just her eyes look down, or either? In my experience only the eyes go the the floor while the head stays upright. Thanks.
They normally avert their gaze and look down or sideways even though I have also encountered some that pretended to intently look at something on the floor (lol).
>This does not mean that you will get laid because plenty of women love getting attention from a man they find attractive, even if they themselves are not sexually available.
This is a frustrating fact I’ve been running into,to be honest. But the lack of any negative response so far(except that 1 time I tried to escalate a little too fast. but that didn’t result in catastrophic consequences and she was still open to interacting with me. Ultimately didn’t get anywhere with her though.)I suppose should indicate I’m at least ahead of dudes on that video.
To be honest,its probably a lack of persistence on my part. I still can’t over the fact that I have to “risk being creepy” but I suppose its a reality one has to deal with if they want to get far in the dating scene.
I think over time that being a PUA and going hard with the cold approach thing can cause a lot of mental issues.
https://www.girlschase.com/article/beloved-day-game-coach-tom-torero-has-died
While I always thought Torero was a dope and think London daygame model=retarded AF, it’s never nice to hear about someone taking their life.
It could very well be that the chick mentioned in the article caused a lot of problems for Torero and could have been a major contributor to his suicide. I have to wonder, though, if deep down Torero was super depressed as he was mid 40’s and likely still doing very poorly with women. I really wonder what the end game/purpose in life is for the PUA’s in their 40’s and 50s?
@ M
Honestly I just feel sad for those people. PUAs in general seem to be pretty clueless and lack decent social skills so they don’t realize when they’re doing something stupid.
Approaching people on the street for getting dates is pretty pointless. Maybe it could work if you’re very handsome.
Of course, a person can live their life however they want. Some people want to chase ladies the rest of their life, some people want to be single, some want a family and some people even want kids.
Still not sure what the end game for PUAs is, really.
There is no happy end game for PUAs. The most (financially) successful of them all, Neil Strauss, tried to get as much money out of it as possible, and quickly moved on. In contrast, Mystery is still trying to shill his snake oil. Someone recently posted that Mystery is offering online coaching to the tune of tends of thousands of dollars, but it is safe to assume that there are no takers.
If you are talking about the act of picking up women as opposed to pick-up as a commercial venture, then there is the issue that as you get older, you primarily get women due to resources, and for that you do not need PUA nonsense. You furthermore cannot fake it. I do not know about Tom Torero’s finances, but he most probably was not independently wealthy. Anybody with a decent 9-to-5 out-earned him and a realization like that is not conducive to the mental health of an aged PUA who wants to pretend to be 20 and fun and outgoing.
Aaron,
There was a PUA by the name Yad who taught in London. I’m not sure if you’ve heard about him back in the PUA heydays. Well, this guy was weird and not good-looking. There was one YouTube video where he did a day game approach. He approached this white girl, and had an instant make-out. I don’t think she was genuinely into him. I speculate that the girl who he approached must have been a paid actress and/or hooker. You can see the kiss that takes place at 29:22
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1FfObVRM6yk
There was another PUA by the name Johnny Berba from London, and this guy was weird. Here he goes around saying “hi” to women randomly in the streets. Unfortunately, a lot of women did not reply back. In the end, all these PUA lack social awareness, and a basic understanding of human behaviour. You can say that most of these guys never had any positive reinforcement from women.
Making out with a random unkempt dude in broad daylight is exactly what a quality woman would do, right? I think your hunch is correct as the body language of the woman seems off. By the way, I ran into Yad in London. He hung out a lot with “Sasha Daygame” whom I met up with a few times. You may recall that guy from a somewhat recent video that gained some prominence. In it he shouts anti-vaxx truths from a car with a megaphone and gets assaulted by a pedestrian.
The name Johnny Berba seems familiar but I do not recall if I met him in person.
How sad. Suicide – the final destination of the “master PUA” . He should be made a poster boy & warning for any young man learning ‘pickup and seduction’. I suspect when his business was taken away his self image imploded and then the realisation he had nothing else and it was all wasted years and threw the rope up.
Poor bastard. Prob got bullied at school no doubt.
Aaron -you forgot to mention that between when Neil Strauss made his money and before he moved on, he still had to go to Sex Addict Rehab and years of psych sessions..to get his brain rewired and undo the damage of all his “learnings” from the “community”.
And Mystery probably stays in hostel Bunk beds in his tours of Europe he’s so broke what a waster.