I have not written a lot about the legal challenges of esteemed PUAs on this blog, in contrast to my former blog on Blogspot. Of course, part of the reason is that the PUA scene is basically dead. It is also the case that after public backlash to maladjusted PUAs accosting women in public there are now a lot fewer people filming themselves getting rejected by women. The other day, though, I received an email that highlights rape denial by a PUA. It is reproduced below.
Dear Aaron,
I contributed the guest post “Roosh Spends $6,500 per Lay” in 2014; it’s been a long time! Recently, I looked at Benjamin Rich’s posts at the reconstituted Rooshvforum.network. He runs the YouTube channel “Bald and Bankrupt”, and posted there under the handle “Vorkuta” and “The Fantasist”. His most most-liked post describes his rape trial.
I originally figured the girl accused falsely because she got blackout drunk and didn’t remember. But on rereading, the description is ludicrous.
I fell asleep on the sofa … woke at 7 … find the girl and my mate ( let’s call him John ) awake in my bed. “Jump in” the girl said with a smile. … After we banged her we were lying on the bed just chatting and she said something along the lines of “if I’d said no you’d have raped me anyway wouldn’t you!”. Laughing I said “oh yes of course, would have set you on fire too no doubt”, just banter, she was laughing, I never thought any more of it. …
Later in the day they came to my cell and told me they were taking me to the doctor for a DNA sample. … It was a female doctor and she asked me to lie on the bed as she was going to insert something into my urethra to take a DNA sample. At this point I started crying ( was that beta? ), I felt like I was being raped. I started telling the doctor that I was innocent, that she was not touching the penis of a rapist.
I waited in the pub next door for my mates to be released. An hour later they came out and we just sat there in the pub unsure what to say. At one point I said to them “did we rape her,we didn’t did we?” I had to ask because after 48 hours of being told you’re a rapist,that you did this despicable crime you start to lose sense of reality,you start to question your own memory,it’s a strange feeling of unease.
It strikes me as implausible that a girl invites a stranger into bed at 7:00 a.m. The DNA story is impossible. DNA samples merely require a cheek swab, not a urethral swab. Finally, I would not ask my friends and codefendants whether we raped anyone, I would ask why that crazy woman is lying! This whole story is fabricated. I am ashamed that I skimmed it too quickly to notice this before.
Good luck getting any Manosphere guys to admit it. I am sick of them.
In a follow-up message, the reader added:
The false rape paranoia on the manosphere forums really bothered me. The criminology literature shows only 2%-11% of accusations reported to police are false.
There was a disturbing study by a Virginia investigator who saved evidence until DNA technology become available. As I recall, a shockingly high percentage of convicted prisoners were later exonerated by DNA. But the problem was not false accusations. It was usually mistaken identification. For example, in one case, two brothers hitchhiked in opposite directions, and one was arrested and convicted for a rape by his similar-looking brother.
Also, most false accusations were completely fabricated, and there was no sex. This includes Brian Banks, Tawana Brawley, and the University of Virginia case featured in Rolling Stone magazine. The motive was often an alibi for an affair. It was occasionally money (Brian Banks) or sympathy (Rolling Stone case). But those idiots in the manosphere were telling young men to illegally film sex in case they were falsely accused. Bad information hurts men.
The manosphere forums had thousands of men posting, but almost no false accusations. All these men were supposedly breaking hearts across the globe! Benjamin Rich originally posted under “Vorkuta”, and changed his handle to “The Fantasist”. This was the one outstanding “real” case. And on rereading, it was obvious fiction. You can read his archived posts here. The other publicized case was Mike Cernovich’s. Here is his description.
Then again, if the defendant had been drunk: How could he have formed criminal intent? Think about it. If everyone is drunk, how can we say a woman was too drunk to consent; but that the man wasn’t too drunk to form intent? If everyone is drunk, then everyone should be presumably equally infirm. Feminists, however, do not want equality.
Thus, if a drunk man has sex with a drunk woman: The drunk man had the mental state to know he was committing rape. The drunk woman lacked the mental state to consent to sex. So, Cernovich’s defense if that it is okay for a drunk man to rape a drunk woman. I guess it is okay for a drunk mugger to rob a drunk victim, or to get drunk and kill another drunk. And Cernovich has a law degree!
I also recall reading “field reports” of PUAs overcoming so-called last-minute resistance, when in fact they were forcing themselves onto these women. I recall one guy writing about a woman who put up excessive physical resistance, and that it took all his strength to overcome it. There surely were some rather shady characters in this scene. Of course there are false rape accusations, but this does not mean that there are no guys out there who rape women.
The reader that contributed this isn’t very good at parsing things. It’s not that 11% of accusations are false. Nobody knows the exact number for sure. When numbers are given about “false are rape accusations” its about those accusations which are “beyond any shadow of a doubt false”
Meaning, they are so fucking outrageoustly and over-the-top provably false that they can prove without a shadow of a doubt that rape couldn’t have possibly happened.
To assume the total number of false accusations is the same as the “so ridiculously fake they couldn’t have possibly happened” is just poor reasoning.
I was just coming down to comment precisely this. There are a large number of alleged rapes that never get reported, out of those that are reported only some get investigated, and of those only a fraction of them are resolved.
Keep in mind that if a woman is making up a false rape accusation, she usually has an incentive to make it as difficult as possible for investigators to figure out what happened. Pursuing a police investigation is usually not required for the false rape victim to reap the benefits of her new victim status, while an investigation may unravel the story.
Assuming the rape accusation is fake, the most common motives seem to be social and psychological:
– attention: she feels alone or neglected and wants friends, family or partners to support her
– alibi: she got caught having sex with someone she should not, either she was cheating or fucking someone not approved by her family, someone from an unacceptable social group for her culture, o engaging in premarital sex where the local culture forbids it.
– shame: she got caught fucking someone or doing something shameful, eg she was in a gangbang and her parents found out.
– diversion: she got caught doing something bad or illegal and wants to divert attention.
-revenge: she feels, rightly or not, that you did her wrong and wants revenge by destroying your reputation.
As you can see, most of the common motives dont require a succesful police investigation in order to have a desired effect.
The scientific literature on this subject is quite sparse, its a difficult subject, and results are pretty much impossible to generalize with any degree of confidence.
Some of the more solid research suggests a false rape claim ratio of around 30%, and this number more or less tracks with information that I have anecdotally recieved from policemen (and policewomen) in the field, but I cannot even remotely claim this to be representative.
It only shows the problem exists, and it strongly suggests the incidence is much higher than popularly assumed.
Ditto. Most motives don’t result in a “so fake it couldn’t have possibly happened” verdict.
The “definite fake” ones are all situations where a woman wasn’t even in the same room or no physical engagement happened.
Most types of false rape accusations are when a woman had consensual sex, but called it rape later on. Those don’t and can’t enter into the “definite fake” stats.
So if the definite fake number is 8% according to the FBI. To believe that the definite fake and total are the same number is absurd.
That means believing 100% of fake accusations are of the “outrageously impossible” variety, and none from the half dozen other types Yarara listed.
The misleasing words here are “reported to the police.” A false accusation could get someone fired, friends and family abandon them, a overall ruin their reputation. If the accuser doesn’t report this to the police then it wouldn’t be included in the statistic. The true rate if false vs true accusations is impossible to measure.
Sometimes the accusations don’t even go so far to say any crime was committed. A guy could be “creepy ,” “made me feel uncomfortable”, “pressured”, etc, which are all rather gray areas since one women might find something creepy while another might think you’re bold, depending on how they perceive you overall. Just look at the gym creeps tiktok trend to get an idea that any man can be accused of being a creepy perv any time regardless of their actions.
When talking about the broader rape issue and how believable the accusations can be, I always remember when the #MeToo crap burst in my country, and also when subsequent sporadic cases arise. The issue is not about false accusations, but rather the more believable ones: it was either very obviously rapey and creepy guys (the betas) or the violent boyfriends (the chads).
The second group was always the same fucking story: stupid girl endures chad boyfriend’s beatings, possessiveness, rapes until like the 3rd visit to the hospital, and 2 or more other girls come forward to say “OMG, I’m an ex and I suffered some of the same!”. Every. Single. Time.
Chad doesn’t get false rape accusations, they get a ton of rape passes! I can only laugh when reading these stories, as if they can’t possibly know better.
Looks aren’t going to save you from accusations. Look at Johnny Depp and Ezra Miller. Being good looking might mean less girls later regret their decision to sleep with you later but there’s no looks shield to protect you.
To add a note about Ezra Miller- he actually appears to have down very bad things, my point is his looks don’t protect him or give him a pass.
@Conrad: Sorry if it came across that my point was what you’re implying. Not at all. It was just a quip about how malleable women’s consent standards are and how they get higher or go out the window altogether under certain circumstances.
Aaron,
1. Are women in general more likely to make a false rape accusation or is this isolated to Cluster B women only?
2. How can a man prevent getting a false rape accusation?
1) I assume that such behavior is much more likely among cluster-B women, but I can also imagine extremely calculating regular women making such claims.
2) There is a dual strategy. First, you do not engage with women who act in an overly impulse way. This may include foregoing some easy lays. Second, you should document your interactions. This is easier than ever before thanks to voice-messages, which you can just download, or messenger services, of which you can easily take screenshots of. You will not be able to prevent a false-rape accusation this way but you will be able to easily defend yourself against one, and if this happens to you, you should also go after her legally to teach her a lesson. Bizarrely, it is not even possible to prevent getting a false rape accusation, not even by avoiding women completely. There were cases were women made up having been raped by some guy they have never even met in real life.
One of the hottest bitches I’ve ever seen in my life is one of these, and I’ve been turning her down for sex for now like 3 years. Just thinking of how hot she is beats any porn out there.
Hours and hours of telling me how I’m her soulmate, and how she should have met me before meeting the guy she had a kid with. I seriously worry that if I have sex, and don’t immediately let her move in with the kid, she’ll tell her existing dude that I “ravaged her” and call the cops.
*Obviously I did get everything else, just didn’t move to penetration.
“*Obviously I did get everything else, just didn’t move to penetration.”
And after she sucked your dick, what’s the difference anyway?
“post-orgasmic clarity” for the win…
@neutral
That’s kind of been my philosophy. I’ve had far more blowjobs and handjobs than full lays, just because mentally it’s like “I scored”. I only go for the full thing if it’s relatively effortless or complication free.